N82 maps and gps without data costs ?

"Ian Rawlings" <news06@tarcus.org.uk> wrote in message
news:slrnfreinm.oja.news06@desktop.tarcus.org.uk.. .
> On 2008-02-16, ColinK <iam247@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> I do not want to pay a subscription for Nokia maps and do not want to
>> pay for data costs while roaming.
>
> Well, nokia maps can do all of it apart from voice-guided directions,
> you can load your maps onto the device so that it doesn't need to use
> the network to load them. I'm not sure on coverage for Europe though
> as I've got no need to check.
>
> If you desperately need voice-guided directions then you won't get
> anything decent for free unless you nick it, however if you find
> something that's nearly there, Nokia Maps actually uses fairly little
> storage space so you can always use whatever directional app you need
> for getting from A to B while using the free services of Nokia Maps to
> make up for any failures. You can plan a route in nokia maps without
> paying for it, all that you can't do is actually use the voice-guided
> navigation, it's pretty good for finding out where you are and what's
> around you, just not much good for use in a car.
>
> I've been playing with Tomtom, Nokia Maps and Garmin Mobile XT in an
> attempt to find out which ones are actually worth using, they're all
> far from perfect, Tomtom would be the best if it supported the
> internal GPS of the N95 but tomtom seem to have deserted the S60
> platform, Garmin would be much better if it didn't crash so often and
> occasionally lose *all* routes, waypoints and settings, and if it had
> better search facilities, and Nokia Maps is a little too simple at the
> moment. I have however not checked out Nokia Maps 2.0 Beta much.
> I've loaded it onto the phone but not played with it so far. Garmin
> does however have the advantage of a PC-based application called
> Mapsource which can make up for some of its shortcomings, including
> being able to restore your data if the mobile app chomps it all,
> although that's not much use if you're away from the computer!
>
> Currently my wallet is waiting for Tomtom 7 with support for the N95
> internal GPS to come out, if it's not out by the middle of the year
> then it'll have to be either Garmin or Nokia Maps (depending on how it
> develops).
>
> However, don't write off Nokia Maps too quickly, it's free for most
> functionality and doesn't need to use the network, and you can buy
> routing capability for a week or month for a very cheap price so you
> can evaluate the product, a feature which you don't get with Garmin or
> Tomtom so you can evaluate it without having to resort to dodgy
> copies. Nokia also seem determined to push it hard, while tomtom have
> left the S60 platform at version 6 without simple changes to enable it
> to work with internal GPSes, so you'd be unwise to buy that at the
> moment unless they show signs of continuing to support the platform.
>
> The copyright nazis will foam at the mouth at this suggestion, but
> your best bet is to get dodgy copies of the main apps for evaluation,
> the software market is difficult because you usually have to pay for
> an app before you can find out if it's any good. There's no way to
> evaluate these complicated apps beforehand without stealing them, then
> of course it's up to your conscience about whether you pay for them.
> Paying will give you access to the online services, which IMHO appear
> to be worth it, they were in tomtom's case, and Garmin's appear to be
> pretty good too. Not a problem with Nokia's payment model though, you
> can thoroughly test it for a minimal fee, and traffic update support
> is in the 2.0 beta although not functioning well yet.


When do you experience crashes with Garmin? That hasn't happened for me and
I use it frequently for prolonged periods.

On 2008-02-18, Ric <No@Way.com> wrote:

> When do you experience crashes with Garmin? That hasn't happened for
> me and I use it frequently for prolonged periods.

So far none while in navigation mode, it's always been when moving
around the menus, doing searches or selecting menu entries, one second
I'm using garmin, next second I'm back at the phone's standby screen.

--
Blast off and strike the evil Bydo empire!
http://youtube.com/user/tarcus69
http://www.flickr.com/photos/tarcus/

In article news:<slrnfrj9ok.oja.news06@desktop.tarcus.org.uk> , Ian
Rawlings wrote:
> Once it's bought, you don't need the net connection.

So the capability to issue voice directions is built-into Nokia Maps,
you just need an active licence to use it? You can plan a route (and
follow it on screen) without paying?

That wasn't clear from anything else I've read about it. It makes the
N95 an altogether much more attractive proposition.

What's the level of detail like on Nokia Maps, compares with (say) the
TomTom?

Does the N95 have worthwhile PIM apps (diary, addressbook, To-Do list)
and are they usable with the keypad? (Yes, I know, this isn't the
really the place to ask, but (as sort-of noted above) it's hard to
discover any meaningful information about these things except by
asking.)

Cheers,
Daniel.

On 2008-02-19, Daniel James <wastebasket@nospam.aaisp.org> wrote:

> So the capability to issue voice directions is built-into Nokia Maps,
> you just need an active licence to use it?

Yes that's right, also traffic updates will be a paid for service too.

> You can plan a route (and
> follow it on screen) without paying?

You can plan a route for free, but it won't plot your position on the
map as then you could use it like Google Maps, which is dangerous in a
car.

> That wasn't clear from anything else I've read about it. It makes the
> N95 an altogether much more attractive proposition.

Not just the N95, any S60 series 3 phone I think, some cheap options
are available. If the phone doesn't have GPS then it can use a
bluetooth GPS. If you're thinking of upgrading your phone then
consider a Nokia S60 series 3 phone, or even a Windows Mobile if
you're into that, they can run tomtom and I'm sure there's other
packages.

> What's the level of detail like on Nokia Maps, compares with (say) the
> TomTom?

I've not noticed any major differences, and I've been a tomtom user
for many years. I live in an area with a lot of small roads and it's
been fine, but I've not used Nokia Maps throughout the country.

> Does the N95 have worthwhile PIM apps (diary, addressbook, To-Do list)
> and are they usable with the keypad? (Yes, I know, this isn't the
> really the place to ask, but (as sort-of noted above) it's hard to
> discover any meaningful information about these things except by
> asking.)

It's OK, but nowhere near as good as Palm's tools, which themselves
were nowhere near as good as Psion's tools. However I've since
learned to use the reduced functionality, and no longer bother with
things like todo categories and event categories like I used to do,
after all there's only one of me, and I ended up with todo lists on my
palm that have hundreds of entries. You have to learn to do without
things like repeating todos (in fact anything other than timed
appointments can't repeat), however this is only if you stick to the
built-in apps, there's a huge number of Symbian applications
available, if you used to load lots of odd stuff onto your current PDA
then it's no different with the N95 and there are a lot of alternative
PIM apps. I use Handy Calendar which is quite simple and just uses
the standard database so there's no compatibility issues with syncing
software but there's much more capable stuff available.

As for the keypad, yes it's pretty usable, more so than trying to use
an on-screen keyboard or handwriting recognition mostly and can be
used one-handed so you can slouch around drinking coffee while sorting
your life out! The predictive text input is good but sometimes some
apps turn it off when presenting you with a text entry box and won't
let you turn it on, which is stupid but not too bad.

So far I'm very impressed with the N95, it doesn't do anything
extremely well, but does lots of things well enough. It's replaced my
ipod and itunes, battery powered speakers, Tomtom 910, Palm T3,
digital snapshot camera and normal mobile phone. It's also good
enough to read websites on, so I read the BBC news website in the
morning on it rather than my desktop computer. You've got at least 3
capable satnav systems available that cost around the £45-£90 mark
although tomtom won't use the internal GPS yet so don't buy that.

--
Blast off and strike the evil Bydo empire!
http://youtube.com/user/tarcus69
http://www.flickr.com/photos/tarcus/

On 2008-02-19, Ian Rawlings <news06@tarcus.org.uk> wrote:

> You've got at least 3 capable satnav systems available that cost
> around the £45-£90 mark although tomtom won't use the internal GPS
> yet so don't buy that.

Something else worth mentioning however is that the phone doesn't have
a touch screen which doesn't really have much impact, it means you can
use the setup one-handed and don't have to keep reaching for a stylus
but on tomtom it does make selecting a specific POI a little harder,
you can however just get the cursor near it, hit a few keys to search
for nearby POIs and select the one you want. Nokia maps and garmin
have a pixel-perfect joystick-controlled pointer that you can use.
The reason I bring this up is because this year, second half I think,
Nokia are bringing out new phones which are supposed to have touch
screens so it might be worth watching what happens. I'm not sure
it'll be an improvement, it's rather a nice change not to have to
occupy your other hand with a stylus to poke away at a screen.

--
Blast off and strike the evil Bydo empire!
http://youtube.com/user/tarcus69
http://www.flickr.com/photos/tarcus/

In article news:<slrnfrlo9b.oja.news06@desktop.tarcus.org.uk> , Ian
Rawlings wrote:
> You can plan a route for free, but it won't plot your position on the
> map as then you could use it like Google Maps, which is dangerous in a
> car.

That sounds like a stupid reason for a limitation. It shouldn't assume
it knows whether you're in a car, and it shouldn't assume that you're
the driver if you are.

I suspect the real reason is to encourage you to pay for the navigation
service.

Thanks for the info, anyway.

> If you're thinking of upgrading your phone then consider a Nokia S60
> series 3 phone, or even a Windows Mobile if you're into that, ...

I can't see any phone out there that I'd want to replace my Nokia
6310i/CARK-91 combo with, TBH. There are lots of devices that have
attractive features but none of them constitute a package that I'd be
prepared to pay for (and replace the car kit, etc). A N95 with HVGA
screen and qwerty keyboard might do it for me ...

I do NOT want Windows Mobile in a phone ... I'd like to think that I'll
only miss calls because I can't hear the ringer and not because the
phone has crashed ... but on the other hand, a phone with GPS in that
could run TomTom and Memory Map would be attractive ... but if it ran MM
I'd want it to be waterproof ...

There are so many bits of kit that have great features, but none of them
have all the features I'd like without any drawbacks.

> It's OK, but nowhere near as good as Palm's tools, which themselves
> were nowhere near as good as Psion's tools.

OK, understood. As a Psion 3, 3a, 3c, 5 (too bulky, back to 3c) and Revo
(crap battery, back to 3c) and more recently Palm Tungsten user I
understand that perfectly.

SymbianOS seems a lot less usable -- and the supplied apps less
functional -- than it was when it was Psion's EPOC (if my wife's SE 910i
is anything to judge by).

> The predictive text input is good ...

Ooh, I HATE predictive text ... or, perhaps, what I mean is that I like
it when it works correctly, but the implementation on the 6310i makes
you jump through too many hoops to override it when it gets things wrong
-- easier just to turn it off (but then "Insert Symbol" disappears from
the options menu) ...

Thanks again for the info.

Cheers,
Daniel.