TDMA Shutdown

karlkrandall@sbcglobal.net wrote:
> On Sun, 18 Mar 2007 03:46:18 -0700, SMS <scharf.steven@geemail.com>
> wrote:
>
>> karlkrandall@sbcglobal.net wrote:
>>> On Sun, 18 Mar 2007 03:12:54 GMT, John Navas
>>> <spamfilter1@navasgroup.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>> On Sat, 17 Mar 2007 08:40:17 -0700, SMS <scharf.steven@geemail.com>
>>>> wrote in <45fc0be2$0$27166$742ec2ed@news.sonic.net>:
>>>>
>>>>> catalpa wrote:
>>>>>> BeyondWireless is telling customers that Cingular is shutting down the
>>>>>> entire TDMA network on March 31, 2008. Is Cingular telling TDMA customers
>>>>>> the same date for shutdown?
>>>>> I think Cingular was saying February 2008, but maybe they built in some
>>>>> margin and Beyond Wireless is taking advantage of that. Cingular is also
>>>>> planning to shut down AMPS at that time, at least all of AMPS that is
>>>>> covered by GSM.
>>>> All of AMPS period.
>>>
>>> I have a friend who got a letter from General Motors informing
>>> them their Onstar Service will cease functioning after Dec. 31, 2007
>> The new OnStar is CDMA, isn't there an option to change the system? Not
>> clear if AMPS is still part of OnStar for non-digital areas.
>
>
> Onstar hasn't said BOO about an upgrade. You have an older system,
> you're S.O.L.
>
> Revised January 16, 2007
>
> Important Information about the Analog-to-Digital Transition
> OnStar service was launched in 1996 using proven analog technology,
> which had the broadest geographic coverage of the available cellular
> network alternatives at the time. Usage of analog technology enabled
> us to evolve into the most comprehensive in-vehicle communications
> provider offering safety, security and peace of mind to millions of
> vehicle owners.
>
> Because OnStar connected to the proven analog network, our technology
> helped ensure that if an airbag deployed in the U.S. or Canada, the
> vehicle would be connected using the cellular network with the largest
> geographical coverage available. Since we signed up our first
> subscriber in 1996, OnStar has assisted subscribers and others in more
> than 3.5 million emergency situations, including airbag deployment
> notifications, remote door unlock requests, roadside assistance, good
> samaritan, and other emergency calls. We are proud of OnStar's
> societal contribution, which not only has been widely recognized by
> our subscribers, but by the emergency response and medical communities
> as well.
>
> However, based on a Federal Communications Commission (FCC) ruling,
> cellular carriers will not be required to support the analog cellular
> network beginning in early 2008. Without the analog network, we can't
> ensure the coverage that will allow us to provide subscribers, with
> analog equipment, the services they expect from us. As a result,
> beginning January 1, 2008, OnStar service in the United States and
> Canada will be available only through vehicles that are capable of
> operating on the digital cellular network.
>
> We at OnStar sincerely regret that we will not be able to provide
> OnStar service to vehicles with analog equipment after December 31,
> 2007. All OnStar subscribers affected by this change will receive a
> letter from OnStar that outlines how this affects their service.


Have they not offered even one word about what their AMPS clients can do
- other than 'see ya'? I'm not an OS client, but surely there's some
plan for preserving their service beyond the magic moment.


--
jer
email reply - I am not a 'ten'

On Sun, 18 Mar 2007 15:49:21 -0500, Jer <gdunn@airmail.ten> wrote:

>karlkrandall@sbcglobal.net wrote:
>> On Sun, 18 Mar 2007 03:46:18 -0700, SMS <scharf.steven@geemail.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>>> karlkrandall@sbcglobal.net wrote:
>>>> On Sun, 18 Mar 2007 03:12:54 GMT, John Navas
>>>> <spamfilter1@navasgroup.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> On Sat, 17 Mar 2007 08:40:17 -0700, SMS <scharf.steven@geemail.com>
>>>>> wrote in <45fc0be2$0$27166$742ec2ed@news.sonic.net>:
>>>>>
>>>>>> catalpa wrote:
>>>>>>> BeyondWireless is telling customers that Cingular is shutting down the
>>>>>>> entire TDMA network on March 31, 2008. Is Cingular telling TDMA customers
>>>>>>> the same date for shutdown?
>>>>>> I think Cingular was saying February 2008, but maybe they built in some
>>>>>> margin and Beyond Wireless is taking advantage of that. Cingular is also
>>>>>> planning to shut down AMPS at that time, at least all of AMPS that is
>>>>>> covered by GSM.
>>>>> All of AMPS period.
>>>>
>>>> I have a friend who got a letter from General Motors informing
>>>> them their Onstar Service will cease functioning after Dec. 31, 2007
>>> The new OnStar is CDMA, isn't there an option to change the system? Not
>>> clear if AMPS is still part of OnStar for non-digital areas.
>>
>>
>> Onstar hasn't said BOO about an upgrade. You have an older system,
>> you're S.O.L.
>>
>> Revised January 16, 2007
>>
>> Important Information about the Analog-to-Digital Transition
>> OnStar service was launched in 1996 using proven analog technology,
>> which had the broadest geographic coverage of the available cellular
>> network alternatives at the time. Usage of analog technology enabled
>> us to evolve into the most comprehensive in-vehicle communications
>> provider offering safety, security and peace of mind to millions of
>> vehicle owners.
>>
>> Because OnStar connected to the proven analog network, our technology
>> helped ensure that if an airbag deployed in the U.S. or Canada, the
>> vehicle would be connected using the cellular network with the largest
>> geographical coverage available. Since we signed up our first
>> subscriber in 1996, OnStar has assisted subscribers and others in more
>> than 3.5 million emergency situations, including airbag deployment
>> notifications, remote door unlock requests, roadside assistance, good
>> samaritan, and other emergency calls. We are proud of OnStar's
>> societal contribution, which not only has been widely recognized by
>> our subscribers, but by the emergency response and medical communities
>> as well.
>>
>> However, based on a Federal Communications Commission (FCC) ruling,
>> cellular carriers will not be required to support the analog cellular
>> network beginning in early 2008. Without the analog network, we can't
>> ensure the coverage that will allow us to provide subscribers, with
>> analog equipment, the services they expect from us. As a result,
>> beginning January 1, 2008, OnStar service in the United States and
>> Canada will be available only through vehicles that are capable of
>> operating on the digital cellular network.
>>
>> We at OnStar sincerely regret that we will not be able to provide
>> OnStar service to vehicles with analog equipment after December 31,
>> 2007. All OnStar subscribers affected by this change will receive a
>> letter from OnStar that outlines how this affects their service.
>
>
>Have they not offered even one word about what their AMPS clients can do
>- other than 'see ya'? I'm not an OS client, but surely there's some
>plan for preserving their service beyond the magic moment.



Further surfing the Onstar online FAQ gives this "SEE YA" message:

Q: Why can't a GM vehicle's analog-only equipment be upgraded?
A: Nearly 90 percent of OnStar subscribers driving GM vehicles are
either capable of operating on the digital cellular network or can be
upgraded to operate on the digital cellular network. When General
Motors and OnStar learned that the FCC would allow cellular service
providers to discontinue providing analog cellular service in 2008, we
engineered digital capable upgrade kits to be compatible with most
electrical systems found in vehicles previously produced by General
Motors. Unfortunately, digital capable upgrade kits were not created
for a small percentage of earlier GM models due to significant
differences in their electrical systems.

karlkrandall@sbcglobal.net wrote:
> On Sun, 18 Mar 2007 15:49:21 -0500, Jer <gdunn@airmail.ten> wrote:
>
>> karlkrandall@sbcglobal.net wrote:
>>> On Sun, 18 Mar 2007 03:46:18 -0700, SMS <scharf.steven@geemail.com>
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>> karlkrandall@sbcglobal.net wrote:
>>>>> On Sun, 18 Mar 2007 03:12:54 GMT, John Navas
>>>>> <spamfilter1@navasgroup.com> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> On Sat, 17 Mar 2007 08:40:17 -0700, SMS <scharf.steven@geemail.com>
>>>>>> wrote in <45fc0be2$0$27166$742ec2ed@news.sonic.net>:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> catalpa wrote:
>>>>>>>> BeyondWireless is telling customers that Cingular is shutting down the
>>>>>>>> entire TDMA network on March 31, 2008. Is Cingular telling TDMA customers
>>>>>>>> the same date for shutdown?
>>>>>>> I think Cingular was saying February 2008, but maybe they built in some
>>>>>>> margin and Beyond Wireless is taking advantage of that. Cingular is also
>>>>>>> planning to shut down AMPS at that time, at least all of AMPS that is
>>>>>>> covered by GSM.
>>>>>> All of AMPS period.
>>>>> I have a friend who got a letter from General Motors informing
>>>>> them their Onstar Service will cease functioning after Dec. 31, 2007
>>>> The new OnStar is CDMA, isn't there an option to change the system? Not
>>>> clear if AMPS is still part of OnStar for non-digital areas.
>>>
>>> Onstar hasn't said BOO about an upgrade. You have an older system,
>>> you're S.O.L.
>>>
>>> Revised January 16, 2007
>>>
>>> Important Information about the Analog-to-Digital Transition
>>> OnStar service was launched in 1996 using proven analog technology,
>>> which had the broadest geographic coverage of the available cellular
>>> network alternatives at the time. Usage of analog technology enabled
>>> us to evolve into the most comprehensive in-vehicle communications
>>> provider offering safety, security and peace of mind to millions of
>>> vehicle owners.
>>>
>>> Because OnStar connected to the proven analog network, our technology
>>> helped ensure that if an airbag deployed in the U.S. or Canada, the
>>> vehicle would be connected using the cellular network with the largest
>>> geographical coverage available. Since we signed up our first
>>> subscriber in 1996, OnStar has assisted subscribers and others in more
>>> than 3.5 million emergency situations, including airbag deployment
>>> notifications, remote door unlock requests, roadside assistance, good
>>> samaritan, and other emergency calls. We are proud of OnStar's
>>> societal contribution, which not only has been widely recognized by
>>> our subscribers, but by the emergency response and medical communities
>>> as well.
>>>
>>> However, based on a Federal Communications Commission (FCC) ruling,
>>> cellular carriers will not be required to support the analog cellular
>>> network beginning in early 2008. Without the analog network, we can't
>>> ensure the coverage that will allow us to provide subscribers, with
>>> analog equipment, the services they expect from us. As a result,
>>> beginning January 1, 2008, OnStar service in the United States and
>>> Canada will be available only through vehicles that are capable of
>>> operating on the digital cellular network.
>>>
>>> We at OnStar sincerely regret that we will not be able to provide
>>> OnStar service to vehicles with analog equipment after December 31,
>>> 2007. All OnStar subscribers affected by this change will receive a
>>> letter from OnStar that outlines how this affects their service.
>>
>> Have they not offered even one word about what their AMPS clients can do
>> - other than 'see ya'? I'm not an OS client, but surely there's some
>> plan for preserving their service beyond the magic moment.
>
>
>
> Further surfing the Onstar online FAQ gives this "SEE YA" message:
>
> Q: Why can't a GM vehicle's analog-only equipment be upgraded?
> A: Nearly 90 percent of OnStar subscribers driving GM vehicles are
> either capable of operating on the digital cellular network or can be
> upgraded to operate on the digital cellular network. When General
> Motors and OnStar learned that the FCC would allow cellular service
> providers to discontinue providing analog cellular service in 2008, we
> engineered digital capable upgrade kits to be compatible with most
> electrical systems found in vehicles previously produced by General
> Motors. Unfortunately, digital capable upgrade kits were not created
> for a small percentage of earlier GM models due to significant
> differences in their electrical systems.


Okay, so around 10% will be left in the dust, so upgrading the vehicle
will be their only option. :(

--
jer
email reply - I am not a 'ten'

I would say It's going to be like cell service.
By the unit at a discounted rate and be in a contract for 2 or more years.

Onstar is going to have to give in somewhere. There not going to risk
the lost of all the customers that can't upgrade. That would spell doom
for onstar if they did.


Jer wrote:
> karlkrandall@sbcglobal.net wrote:
>> On Sun, 18 Mar 2007 15:49:21 -0500, Jer <gdunn@airmail.ten> wrote:
>>
>>> karlkrandall@sbcglobal.net wrote:
>>>> On Sun, 18 Mar 2007 03:46:18 -0700, SMS <scharf.steven@geemail.com>
>>>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> karlkrandall@sbcglobal.net wrote:
>>>>>> On Sun, 18 Mar 2007 03:12:54 GMT, John Navas
>>>>>> <spamfilter1@navasgroup.com> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> On Sat, 17 Mar 2007 08:40:17 -0700, SMS <scharf.steven@geemail.com>
>>>>>>> wrote in <45fc0be2$0$27166$742ec2ed@news.sonic.net>:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> catalpa wrote:
>>>>>>>>> BeyondWireless is telling customers that Cingular is shutting
>>>>>>>>> down the
>>>>>>>>> entire TDMA network on March 31, 2008. Is Cingular telling
>>>>>>>>> TDMA customers
>>>>>>>>> the same date for shutdown?
>>>>>>>> I think Cingular was saying February 2008, but maybe they built
>>>>>>>> in some margin and Beyond Wireless is taking advantage of that.
>>>>>>>> Cingular is also planning to shut down AMPS at that time, at
>>>>>>>> least all of AMPS that is covered by GSM.
>>>>>>> All of AMPS period.
>>>>>> I have a friend who got a letter from General Motors informing
>>>>>> them their Onstar Service will cease functioning after Dec. 31,
>>>>>> 2007
>>>>> The new OnStar is CDMA, isn't there an option to change the
>>>>> system? Not clear if AMPS is still part of OnStar for non-digital
>>>>> areas.
>>>>
>>>> Onstar hasn't said BOO about an upgrade. You have an older system,
>>>> you're S.O.L.
>>>>
>>>> Revised January 16, 2007
>>>>
>>>> Important Information about the Analog-to-Digital Transition
>>>> OnStar service was launched in 1996 using proven analog technology,
>>>> which had the broadest geographic coverage of the available cellular
>>>> network alternatives at the time. Usage of analog technology enabled
>>>> us to evolve into the most comprehensive in-vehicle communications
>>>> provider offering safety, security and peace of mind to millions of
>>>> vehicle owners.
>>>>
>>>> Because OnStar connected to the proven analog network, our technology
>>>> helped ensure that if an airbag deployed in the U.S. or Canada, the
>>>> vehicle would be connected using the cellular network with the largest
>>>> geographical coverage available. Since we signed up our first
>>>> subscriber in 1996, OnStar has assisted subscribers and others in more
>>>> than 3.5 million emergency situations, including airbag deployment
>>>> notifications, remote door unlock requests, roadside assistance, good
>>>> samaritan, and other emergency calls. We are proud of OnStar's
>>>> societal contribution, which not only has been widely recognized by
>>>> our subscribers, but by the emergency response and medical communities
>>>> as well.
>>>>
>>>> However, based on a Federal Communications Commission (FCC) ruling,
>>>> cellular carriers will not be required to support the analog cellular
>>>> network beginning in early 2008. Without the analog network, we can't
>>>> ensure the coverage that will allow us to provide subscribers, with
>>>> analog equipment, the services they expect from us. As a result,
>>>> beginning January 1, 2008, OnStar service in the United States and
>>>> Canada will be available only through vehicles that are capable of
>>>> operating on the digital cellular network.
>>>>
>>>> We at OnStar sincerely regret that we will not be able to provide
>>>> OnStar service to vehicles with analog equipment after December 31,
>>>> 2007. All OnStar subscribers affected by this change will receive a
>>>> letter from OnStar that outlines how this affects their service.
>>>
>>> Have they not offered even one word about what their AMPS clients
>>> can do - other than 'see ya'? I'm not an OS client, but surely
>>> there's some plan for preserving their service beyond the magic moment.
>>
>>
>>
>> Further surfing the Onstar online FAQ gives this "SEE YA" message:
>> Q: Why can't a GM vehicle's analog-only equipment be upgraded?
>> A: Nearly 90 percent of OnStar subscribers driving GM vehicles are
>> either capable of operating on the digital cellular network or can be
>> upgraded to operate on the digital cellular network. When General
>> Motors and OnStar learned that the FCC would allow cellular service
>> providers to discontinue providing analog cellular service in 2008, we
>> engineered digital capable upgrade kits to be compatible with most
>> electrical systems found in vehicles previously produced by General
>> Motors. Unfortunately, digital capable upgrade kits were not created
>> for a small percentage of earlier GM models due to significant
>> differences in their electrical systems.
>
>
> Okay, so around 10% will be left in the dust, so upgrading the vehicle
> will be their only option. :(
>

"Kevin Weaver" <kevinkeithweaver@sbcglobal.net> wrote in message
news:78mLh.14377$FG1.12091@newssvr27.news.prodigy. net...
>I would say It's going to be like cell service.
> By the unit at a discounted rate and be in a contract for 2 or more years.
>
> Onstar is going to have to give in somewhere. There not going to risk the
> lost of all the customers that can't upgrade. That would spell doom for
> onstar if they did.
>
>


OnStar is not in a position to give in. They do not operate the cellular
networks. If AMPS is turned off, OnStar suffers just as their customers do.

As I understand it, AMPS operates at higher power, and has the potential to
offer better coverage than do digital PCS networks. Even if OnStar converts
everyone to digital there is the probability that there will be major
coverage gaps, especially in less-populated areas.

Of course, there is the chance that public outcry will be so loud, once AMPS
is shut down and large groups of users find that they have inadequate
coverage (or no coverage at all) that the FCC may recant. I anticipate an
uproar once people lose their AMPS service. Time will tell.

jeremy wrote:

> Of course, there is the chance that public outcry will be so loud, once AMPS
> is shut down and large groups of users find that they have inadequate
> coverage (or no coverage at all) that the FCC may recant. I anticipate an
> uproar once people lose their AMPS service. Time will tell.

They won't recant, but there's a chance that they will extend the
shutdown date.

On Mon, 19 Mar 2007 01:59:31 UTC, Kevin Weaver
<kevinkeithweaver@sbcglobal.net> wrote:

> I would say It's going to be like cell service.
> By the unit at a discounted rate and be in a contract for 2 or more years.
>
> Onstar is going to have to give in somewhere. There not going to risk
> the lost of all the customers that can't upgrade. That would spell doom
> for onstar if they did.

II wonder the number of people driving 5+ year old OnStar equipped
cars who still maintain their service. People willing to spend this
money monthly but not buying a new car in this time.

The older service didn't offer some of the newer features added in
recent years, such as use as a cell phone, navigation, etc. So it was
payment for lost keys, accident help, etc.

On Mon, 19 Mar 2007 05:13:41 GMT, "jeremy" <jeremy@nospam.com> wrote in
<9_oLh.8573$282.5653@trndny04>:

>As I understand it, AMPS operates at higher power, and has the potential to
>offer better coverage than do digital PCS networks. Even if OnStar converts
>everyone to digital there is the probability that there will be major
>coverage gaps, especially in less-populated areas.

Not true (on both counts).

>Of course, there is the chance that public outcry will be so loud, once AMPS
>is shut down and large groups of users find that they have inadequate
>coverage (or no coverage at all) that the FCC may recant. I anticipate an
>uproar once people lose their AMPS service.

I seriously doubt it (on both counts).

>Time will tell.

As always.

--
Best regards, SEE THE FAQ FOR CINGULAR WIRELESS AT
John Navas <http://en.wikibooks.org/wiki/Cingular_Wireless_FAQ>